First National Bank Building asked folks to "enjoy seat" where Chris Lollie sat before arrest

FirstNatlBankLollie.jpg
Lollie says he was sitting in the chair second closest to the camera in the picture at right when he was arrested in the First National Bank Building's skyway.
:::: UPDATE :::: Pioneer Press photog told to stop shooting in "private" St. Paul skyway

One of the controversies surrounding Chris Lollie's rough, racially charged arrest in the First National Bank Building's skyway is whether the seat he was sitting in when a security guard asked him to leave is in a public space.

A post on the First National Bank Building's Facebook page suggests it is.

See also:
St. Paul police defend Chris Lollie arrest; lawyers question aggressive use of force

Here's the post, which was published in September 2009 but is newsy after video of Lollie's arrest hit the internet:

firstnationalbankpost.jpg
Facebook

We texted Lollie a screengrab of the post and asked him if he can confirm it shows the very chair he sat in before his arrest.

"I sure can, it's the one in the first set facing toward the camera," he replies.

We also asked Lollie how long he was sitting in the chair before a security guard approached and started giving him a hard time.

"Two minutes after," he replies. The guard "walked up to me, we talked for about two or three minutes."

"I sat down at 9:40 [a.m.] and by roughly 9:45 our conversation was done and he was calling the police," Lollie continues.

stPaularrest.jpg
Lollie's mugshot

But in a statement defending the conduct of officers who handled Lollie's arrest, St. Paul police say they were summoned to the scene on a report of "a man who was trespassing in a private area."

(For more, click to page two.)



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64 comments
Scott Dentz
Scott Dentz

I still don't understand why he even sat down there, why didn't he just go get his kids from the day care center? Not that it makes anything these worthless pigs did justified! I just haven't heard the reason for his waiting until 10 when his kids got out. Got out from new horizon day care, its day care not school.

Geneelo
Geneelo

@Geneelo The general public was invited - if tired, to 'take 5' See Bank's Facebook page 2009. Then Chris Lollie was arrested for trespass

Brian Steidl
Brian Steidl

Need some folks to just sit down and civilly interact with whom ever comes there way. Passive resistance shows just how over reactive they were.

Shawn Spence
Shawn Spence

Refusing to cooperate with what, an illegal request? A violation of a couple of Constitutional amendments? The police were provably not just doing their job.

Shawn Spence
Shawn Spence

Did you see his "defense" of his officers? Pathetic.

Stephen Biondo
Stephen Biondo

Except for the fact that what the police were asking him for, to identify himself without committing a crime, is illegal.

Sarah Lawl
Sarah Lawl

Amen Donna! Tired of them...those bastidds lol make over $200 a day.... Why do people hand hard earned money to people just because they are holding a sign? If they can make a sign...they can fill out an application and then stand at MC Ds and get paid. As for you Carolyn...I would suggest you start by not carrying "change, looseys, lighters, sammiches" :D

Donna Hollies
Donna Hollies

Carolyn Murray why don't you ask all the white people standing at the freeway off ramps asking for money? Ijs

Carolyn Murray
Carolyn Murray

so who can us white folk sue when we are harassed and intimidated for change, looseys, lighters, sammiches, whateva we got? Keep walkin'.

Carolyn Murray
Carolyn Murray

It'll be worth his 15 minutes of brutality after Saul takes his third.

Craig Viknx
Craig Viknx

If ya black ya must be doing bad ...Thought Minnesota had more class then that , Because I was raised all are equal till they prove otherwise.

Cat Lemke
Cat Lemke

Except for the fact that the police were doing their job and Lollie was refusing to cooperate. If you're going to jump on anyone, it's the security guard was the one who called the police. The police were just doing their job.

alihauck
alihauck

President of the police union Dave Titus is a racist cop defending other racist cops. You do not have to identify yourself when sitting in a public area doing nothing. I think all cops should be arrested in the manner they are doing it so they can see how it feels.

Sarah Lawl
Sarah Lawl

Wont be precedent I'm sure....racism has been here for years. But...he will get paid!

Sarah Lawl
Sarah Lawl

Thanks again bitch ass St Paul Police....while you fucks get paid by the people to do a job AND stay within your scope of employment...you did not.... Now....you assholes also not only get paid leave ect .... but now your dumbasses are getting sued. Guess who pays the lawsuit? Sure as hell wont be the crooked fucking police or their Constantly Lethargic looking police cheif...it will be the same people who paid these fucks to do a job they didn't do in the first place.

Meng Her
Meng Her

Well, Titus is a dipshit!

Angel Andrews
Angel Andrews

That head of the police union NEEDS TO RESIGN!!! He obviously isn't doing his job to train the officer's properly. Mr Lollie was totally within his rights to refuse to answer any of those officer's questions... And this incident should be prosecuted as hate/racism charge!!!

Andy Fitton
Andy Fitton

Very skeptical of this story. I walk through there every day and there are almost always black, asian or hispanics at the security desk. Is there a video of the incident?

Joey Vincent
Joey Vincent

Watch the first full interview of Chris Lollie. Chris granted "Filter Free Amerika" his first ever, full length interview detailing his assault and kidnapping by members of the Saint Paul, MN Police Department. He explains in complete detail the events before and after the now viral YouTube video of his incident as well as how it all went down in court when all of his fraudulent charges were thrown out. You will not believe the parts of the story NOT yet made public! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fn_8ErWbqo

HerbDickerson
HerbDickerson

Mr. Lollie, like many of you sympathizing with him, never learned much in Civics class.
You argue your innocence in court NOT with the police.
Police were asked to investigate.  When they investigated Lollie walked away from officers, argued with them whether they could arrest him (like a mail order degree lawyer spouting "legalese" and then struggle with the officer who was lawfully detaining him.  
IN OUR SOCIETY OF LAWS, you don't tell the cops to "go away" and then refuse to comply with being taken into custody.
REGARDLESS of whether you think he was sitting legally or illegally, once the officer says "stop".  You stop.  If you put up a verbal and physical resistance then the officer is legally allowed to overcome your resistance with the force necessary to overcome that resistance.

Lollie treated the female officer like he just does whatever he wants and when backup arrived, he continued to insult their authority to stop him, detain him and investigate why he was trying to run away from them.
POLICE ARE GIVEN THE AUTHORITY TO USE FORCE NECESSARY TO OVERCOME RESISTANCE.  
Here's the use of force continuum (try to follow along):
1) uniformed presence.  Lollie disregarded the badge/office of the female police officer with blatant disregard
2) verbal warnings. Lollie verbally and physically disregarded the officers order to stop walking away.
3) physical restraint. Lollie continued to verbally argue with the officer and physically resist being handcuffed.
4) use of weaponry (taser, baton, mace).  The officer are not required to meet resistance with equal force.  We pay them to enforce the law and preserve the peace, when someone disregards the officers lawful presence, commands or arrest, the officers are allowed (and hell, for their safety) to use more force than the suspect.  THEY ARE ALLOWED TO TASER FIGHTERS> THEY ARE ALLOWED TO SHOOT PEOPLE WITH A KNIFE.  
That is the fucking law.  You don't like it?  then change it through the legislature but I'd like to see your alternative... anarchy?  pretty please? oh, you're running away?  ok, see you later, bye bye? 
If you think you are innocent, you plead your case in court, not with the officer at the scene.
These officers did nothing wrong.

Joey.vincent
Joey.vincent

Watch the first full interview of Chris Lollie. Chris granted "Filter Free Amerika" his first ever, full length interview detailing his assault and kidnapping by members of the Saint Paul, MN Police Department. He explains in complete detail the events before and after the now viral YouTube video of his incident as well as how it all went down in court when all of his fraudulent charges were thrown out. You will not believe the parts of the story NOT yet made public! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fn_8ErWbqo 


Xiong Thao
Xiong Thao

Police need to stop playing politics and act like they are above the law. The cops should be punished.

Justin Miller
Justin Miller

I live two blocks away and walk past there all the time. There are often people sitting in that space during the day and I've not seen any signage stating that it's a private area. I think we should all get "don't tase me bro" tees and stage a sit-in.

Mark Muller
Mark Muller

Tht vid was hard to watch/listen to. He handled it perfectly in my opinion. He deserves to win his lawsuit. I can only hope tht other PD's can watch & learn on how NOT to act in situations like ths!

sbreezy
sbreezy

He was early to pick up his kids from their school/day care.  My children were in a pre-k center at 3 and it ended at a specific time, you didn't just wander in randomly.  At the end of the day if the picture shows a public seating area, inviting people to sit, why does it matter?  Why is his presence a threat?

Charlie
Charlie

I agree.  That's what the officers should have done

mwalcoff
mwalcoff

I don't get the relation? You can be arrested for vagrancy...why would anyone provoke the police? 


You can't fix stupid!

cknight1107
cknight1107

Minnesota is not a "stop and identify" state. The police had no right to demand that Lollie identify himself. They were not doing their jobs, they were abusing their authority. Lollie is filing a federal lawsuit and I hope he wins big!

profalwg
profalwg

if what the cops was asking is unwarranted then yes Lollie had the perfect right to refuse.  The security moron had no business approaching Lollie to begin with. With no signage, there was no reason to say it was ''employees only'' especially if Lollie had been in that area before while waiting to pick up his kids.

sbreezy
sbreezy

The police were doing their job incorrectly.  Wearing a uniform and having a badge doesn't immediately make you higher than the law, you are required to uphold AND obey the law.  They violated his rights (the general rights) by requiring him to identify himself without cause.  He had the right to refuse.  Again, if there is no law being broken what are you upholding?  They allowed their personal offense to get in the way as in, 'how dare he refuse to answer my questions'.

MNjoe
MNjoe topcommenter

Yeah - so were the Nazis. 

heidi2767
heidi2767

Thanks so much for doing that interview!

evdebs
evdebs

@HerbDickerson I'm sorry Mr. Dirckerson, but you are simply incorrect.  In America we have every right to argue our innocence at any moment we please, not just in court.  If we do so it is not considered an offense under our laws and certainly not an offense justifying physical interference with or arrest of the individual.  This is very closely related to what makes us America.

Second, there is all the difference in the world--in law and in common sense--between arguing ("verbal resistance') and physical resistance.  

Third, even if someone gets 'disrespectful' this is specifically and wonderfully exactly your right as an American.  this is just what the first Amendment is for.

i could go on and on--yes, officers are entitled to use force, even at times dangerous force such as tasers, when justified, but no this definitely does NOT mean whenever some officer *feels* it is justified.  and certainly not because the individual is 'disregarding' the officers as you put it.  

I could go on and on, but i suspect that you view all these facts and factors through such an authoritarian lens that you would not understand.

but the result is that your interpretation and your conclusions are both simply wrong and also contrary to long established American traditions.

ksjoyner
ksjoyner

@HerbDickerson Every American citizen has the right to refuse an illegal order being given by a police officer. You also have the right to resist an illegal arrest. These sworn "peace" officers were violating the 4th Amendment which gives you the right to be free of illegal search and seizure. With no crime committed there was no right to "search" (ask for id) or seize - arrest. 

DevonNewman
DevonNewman

@HerbDickerson


I don't think you're a lawyer, HD, otherwise you'd know that in many states it's quite legal to resist, even with violence, an "unlawful arrest".  MN is not one of those states, however, so the officers may not have been acting unlawfully if they thought they were responding to a valid criminal complaint.  They (including the St. Paul PD) should, of course, get their head handed to them in any civil suit as you don't taser someone for allegedly 'tresspassing'.


Bottom line:  If a police officer tries to perform an unlawful arrest in a life threating way, at least here in PA, it's quite possible the cop is the one that's going to go 'legally' to the morgue.


Google "resist unlawful arrest' for more details, but make sure you review more recent rulings as the anti-gubmint sites tend to only quote the ancient cases that don't reflect today's legal environment.

HerbDickerson
HerbDickerson

I believe there is racism.  I believe our country incarcerates way too many black men.  I believe that racial inequality must be addressed and righted.  I do.  I really do (more than you may will ever realize)
BUT the reality is.  WHERE THE VIDEO STARTS>>>police would have treated any white man the same exact way.
Were the police called by security because Lollie was black and a white man would not have been bothered?  Yes, I do believe that is a stark and sad reality that should be changed/fought for/inexcusably never condoned?  FUCK YES.

But when the police say stop.  You shut up and stop and you can't be suprised when they taser you when you pull away from them when they are arresting you

HerbDickerson
HerbDickerson

walking away from and arguing with police officers and then struggling when  being detained is your definition of handling it perfectly?  how dumb are you?

mwalcoff
mwalcoff

@sbreezy - According to this story, this guy has had other run ins with the security guards in this building and I quote "The guards reported that the man had on repeated occasions refused to leave a private 'employees only' area in the First National Bank Building,"


It appears that this guy isn't the angel he professes to be!

evdebs
evdebs

@mwalcoff This case is a pretty good example of the person being very UNprovocative.  If the Police are going to take any assertion of a citizen's rights as 'provoking' them, then we have crossed the line into police state territory.

i know, i know, this is already the case in too many jurisdictions.  doesn't make it right. 

this man was assaulted by the police officers for standing up for his rights and for common sense.

cknight1107
cknight1107

@DevonNewman Minnesota is not a "stop and identify" state. Lollie was no under any obligation to identify himself and had committed no crime. The seats he was asked to leave are public, as confirmed by First National Bank.

send2chrisjames
send2chrisjames

@HerbDickerson So if I see you walking down the street in front of my business and I don't want you using the sidewalk in front of my building is it logical for me to call the police on you? If the police do respond and try to detain you and identefy you, do you have to abide if you were never breaking any laws to begin with? If you answer yes, you're even more of a moron than I already thought by reading your garbage.

cknight1107
cknight1107

@HerbDickerson You're the dumbass if you're willing to blindly submit to police, no questions asked. The Nazis would have loved you, though.

scalliwag
scalliwag

@mwalcoff Almost every person I know who has called a policeman or ambulance has embellished or exaggerated the circumstances trying to get a prompt response.  Then often, they later retract their description if in court, like George Zimmerman's girlfriend who called  and said he threatened her with a gun, then later said he didn't show his gun.  Like the man who called and said a man was waving a gun in Walmart and pointing it at people, then after the man was shot dead, did NOT say the same thing.  I witnessed a woman calling the police after a traffic accident and argument, and saying, "This man is threatening me.  I think he has a gun."  Fortunately, the police didn't show up with  guns drawn and shoot the man.

What about the stranded auto accident college football player in Georgia who knocked on the door of the nearest house for help late at night. The woman inside called the police and said someone was trying to break into her house, not there is someone I don't know knocking on my door.  The police arrived, he ran toward them (thinking help had arrived?) and they shot him dead.

People often exaggerate to get the police or ambulance or fire truck there sooner!!!  The police should know this.  You should not believe everything on its surface.

cknight1107
cknight1107

@mwalcoff Except that the area he was asked to leave is not a private area. I live in St. Paul and use to work in the building across the street. I have sat in those exact same seats on several occasions (in my milky white skin) eating lunch, sipping coffee and reading a book. Even the building's Facebook page says, "Need to take five? Enjoy a seat here! (or words to that effect) with a picture of the very seats Lollie was asked to leave because they're supposedly private. 

profalwg
profalwg

@mwalcoff;

here we go...''other run ins...'' ''...isn't the angel...'' typical of demonizing the victim while letting the aberrant and increasing SOP behavior of the so-called ''professional cops'' be ignored...the security officer was wrong, the cops were wrong...he did nothing wrong sitting and waiting for his children, so he has a legitimate complaint...how is that so hard for folks like you to understand? 

nocdib
nocdib

@cknight1107 @HerbDickerson No, @cknight1107 , you're the dumbass. The cops got a call that someone was trespassing so they did their job by investigating. He had every right not to show his ID and they had every right to arrest him. When he resisted arrest then it had to get physical. When a cop says stop just stop. He caused a problem with police when his real problem was with bank security. He won't win anything in a civil suit with police.

cknight1107
cknight1107

@nocdib -- It's people like you, completely ignorant of the law and civil rights, but totally willing to bow to authority figures in blind obedience who make it hard for those of us who DO know our rights and DO care about civil liberties. People like you also give the police a free pass to abuse their power and authority.

The cops should have informed the security guard that the seating was open to the public, Lollie was minding his own business, and that there was nothing for them to do there. And then move on. Period. Minnesota is not a "stop and identify state" meaning that the police have no authority to demand that someone identify themselves and arrest them if they refuse. Officer Hayne, if she is at all worthy of donning that uniform, should have been able to determine that no crime was in progress, and then gone about conducting REAL police business.

"When a cop says stop just stop".

No way. This is not a police state and I have no intention of helping to pave the way for it become one. If I'm sitting in a public seating area minding my own business and the police tell me to identify myself and explain my business, they had better have a damn good explanation. If they don't, I have every right to walk away or completely ignore them. This is not 1930's Germany and we don't demand that people show their "papers" just to walk down the street!

"He caused a problem with police when his real problem was with bank security."

No, his problem was with police clearly and blatantly overstepping their boundaries. Try learning a little something about the law and civil liberties before making a complete and utter fool of yourself. Thanks.

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